Secret vs. Hidden: Perception in Old School Play

Refined "Old School Search Procedure" 

1. Declare who is searching and number of turns spent to create initial dice pool

• Clerics, Fighters, Halflings, Magic Users, Thieves add 1d6 per turn
• Dwarves (underground) & Elves add 2d6 per turn
• Only Elf, Dwarf (underground), & Thief hirelings add 1d6 per turn
  

2. Divide dice pool by squares being searched (round up). Max one square per dice.

3. Roll dice pool. A single 1 indicates a success.

Example:

A Fighter (1d6), Cleric (1d6), Elf (2d6), and Halfling (1d6) with two hirelings; a thief (1d6) and a dwarf (1d6) enter a 30'x30' chamber. Their "Search Pool" is 7d6.

DM: You enter an ancient chapel with a vaulted ceiling from the west. Profane tapestries raggedly sag from the walls, save one one the north wall to the left of the alter that looks almost new. The alter itself is basalt caked in grime that glistens crimson in your torchlight. Broken pews line the room. Another entry can be seen in the middle of the south wall.

Caller: We are going to spend 1 turn searching this room. I (Elf) specifically want to check out that tapestry, the Cleric is going to search the alter, and the halfling is rummaging through the pews.

DM: The room is 9 total squares so it cannot be entirely searched in 1 turn. Do you want to select 7 squares to search, or take 2 turns?

Caller: We will take 2 turns.

DM: I am rolling 2d6 (14 / 9 = 1.55 or 2). [Rolls 3, 5 - no success]. The tapestry elaborately depicts what looks to be prisoners being thrown off of a cliff into the shadowy jaws of some ancient beast. An inspection of the alter reveals heavy maroon book with silver lettering on the cover written in an infernal script that you cannot read. Among the pews you find a dead body, quite old but not as ancient as this place, in dark robes. Nothing else of interest is found. Do you want to do anything further with the tapestry, book, or body?

Elf: I want to look behind the tapestry.

Cleric: I cast detect evil on the book.

Halfling: I'll loot the body.

DM: When you reach out to move the tapestry there is a faint shimmer and your hand passes through it. It is clearly an illusion. The book most certainly radiates evil. The body has an ornate dagger with a black squiggly blade and a ruby set on the pommel along with a purse containing 7gp and 3sp.

Elf: I stick my head and torch through the tapestry to see what is on the other side.

Cleric: I'll leave that book alone.

Halfling: I'll take the dagger and the purse.

DM: On the other side of the tapestry a narrow 5' hall extends 30 feet north into darkness. As you pick up the dagger you feel your fingers tighten painfully around its hilt.

Halfling: Shit.

<End of Example>

I wrote the above example to show how the search procedure that I have begun using works in play, but then I realized it also demonstrates something else. A lot of ink has been spilled about "Perception Checks" in old school D&D. I frequent the r/OSR sub on Reddit and it is probably a top 5 discussion topic. As soon as someone asks the question they are assaulted with a chorus of "You don't! Player skill over Character skill! The answer isn't on your character sheet!" Heck, I bought that particular brand of Kool-Aid myself and I'm sure if you scrub through my comment history you'd find me singing that particular refrain.

One problem. I don't do it like that at my table. It is much more nuanced. After allowing it to take up more brain space than I probably should have, I'm ready to explore the topic here. It really comes down to do two similar, but fundamentally different, concepts: Secret vs. Hidden.

Secret: not known or seen or not meant to be known or seen by others.

Hidden:  kept out of sight; concealed.

Things that are secret AND things that are hidden are both not supposed to be found, however something that is secret was NEVER meant to be found. Something that is hidden was, presumably, at some previous point not hidden.

How are those differences presented in play?

A door behind a tapestry, a safe behind a hung painting, a hallway that has been walled off, or a trapdoor under a rug are hidden. They were not always concealed, they were once visible and then at a later point they were obfuscated. These things are easily identified through player skill. If a character looks behind the tapestry, removes the painting, breaks the plaster, or rips away the rug the true nature of the thing will be revealed.

The stone wall that slides away when the torch sconce is turned, the bookcase that swings open when you pull out the right book, and the desk compartment that pops open when the panel is pressed in just the right spot are secret. They were specifically designed to avoid detection, even under scrutiny. They were never meant to be found. These things require a roll, usually 1-in-6, to be found.

Back to the example the players found three hidden things because of their Player Skill. They found the hidden tunnel behind the illusory tapestry, they found the Book of Vile Rites, and they found the cursed Dagger of Sacrifice. These things were not readily apparent when they walked in the room and their descriptions of their actions revealed them. What they did not find was the secret sliding wall section on the east wall that is activated by pressing a certain stone on either side at the same time. For that they would have needed to pass their check.

It is important to note: Secret things should not be required to progress through the dungeon. On the other side of that sliding wall is some sweet loot, but not finding it will not impede forward progress through the dungeon.

Math behind the change on demihuman searching

Demihuman search abilities (dwarf, elf) detect secrets on 1-in-6 but they get to roll 2d6.  Mathematically rolling 1-in-6 on 2d6 has a 31% chance of success, and rolling 2-in-6 on 1d6 has a 33% chance of success. The difference is negligible (2.77%) but I think the change in approach can really increase speed of play by making search a single roll per room.

 In the example that 30'x30'x10' room had 900 square feet of floor, 900 square feet of ceiling, and 1,200 square feet of walls for a total of 3,000 square feet. To search it in its entirety it would have taken 30 total turns. With all six of them searching that would have been five turns.

If they ignored the ceiling (beyond maybe a cursory glance to make sure there were no murder holes) it still would have taken 4 (3.5) turns.

If they ignored the floor and they were just searching walls, as adventurers tend to do, they could do it in 2 turns. I'm throwing in the ceiling and floor for free because I'm not a dick.

Additionally, in those 2 turns they would have between a 17% and 33% chance of success on any of the 12 available 10'x10' surfaces searched to succeed. It becomes extremely important, and tedious, to know who is specifically searching which section.

Using the dice pool, the party took 2 turns and had a 30.56% chance of success, so slightly more generous than RAW which I attribute to the party working as a team.

"Hey dwarf, come over here and check out this stonework. What do you think?"

 

 

A History of Silence

Silence has always been a problematic spell for me. It is a wildly powerful AoE that shuts down enemy casters, often without a saving throw when players cast it on a rock, arrow, or other such nonsense. I decided to go back through the books and understand how we arrived at the modern incarnation of the Silence spell from its humble OD&D roots through the split of the AD&D and Basic/Expert lines (and did they treat it differently). Finally, I give the OD&D version a “B/X Treatment” to bring it back in line with what I am reading as “original intent.”

OD&D Supplement #1: Greyhawk (1975)

Silence, 15 ft. Radius

This spell allows the user to either cast Silence upon himself and his party so as to move with no sound or to cast the spell upon some object or thing to silence it. Duration: 12 turns. Range: 18"

This is the first time the Silence spell shows up (directly following the Little Brown Books) and it does not indicate that it interferes with conversation or spellcasting. In fact, the main thrust of the spell reads like it is meant to be cast on oneself or party to make them quiet. The spell does not indicate that there is a save against it, another nod that it is not weaponized.

Holmes Basic (1977)

Silence: 15' Radius

Level: clerical 2; Range: 180 feet; Duration: 12 turns

Allows the user to cast silence in a large area so as to prevent sound or allow his party to move noiselessly. It can be used to silence some object as well. Note conversation is not possible under a silence spell.

Here we have the Holmes interpretation of the Silence spell and it picks up the note about conversation. However, it also once again puts forward the idea that the intent of the spell is to help the party move noiselessly about the dungeon. There is also another subtle change in the language of this spell indicating that it can be cast over an area, previously the spell read as needing to be cast on (a) person(s) or object. Again, there is no save listed as the spell has not yet been weaponized.

“A New Look at Illusionists” by Rafael Ovalle (Dragon #12 February 1978)

Displacement 10’ radius: As clerical silence in description, duration and range, but the effect is

displacement.

Personal Silence: As clerical silence for caster.

The cited article is a fascinating look at illusionists building off the illusionist that first appeared in Strategic Review Volume 1 Number 4 and then elaborated on in Dragon #1. Hence, the spell references in these descriptions can only be assumed to harken back to the Silence 15 ft Radius spell introduced in OD&D Supplement #1 Greyhawk. “Personal Silence” in particular being added to the illusionist class makes me think that the Silence spell was not universally understood at this point in time to hinder spellcasting (otherwise this would be an extremely limiting spell slipped into an article that was generally pumping up the power level of illusionist).

AD&D Players Handbook (1978)

Silence, 15’ Radius

Level: 2 Range: 12" Duration: 2 rounds/level Area of Effect: 30' diameter sphere Components: V, S Casting Time: 5 segments Saving Throw: None

Explanation/Description: Upon casting this spell, complete silence prevails In the area of its effect. All sound is stopped, so all conversation is impossible, spells cannot be cast, and no noise whatsoever issues forth, The spell can be cast into the air or upon an object. The spell of silence lasts for 2 rounds for each level of experience of the clerk, i.e. 2 rounds at 1st level, 4 at 2nd, 6 at 3rd, 8 at 4th and so forth. The spell can be cast upon a creature, and the effect will then radiate from the creature and move as it moves. If the creature is unwilling, it saves against the spell and if the saving throw is made, the spell effect locates about one foot behind the target creature.

The weaponization of Silence appears to happen first in AD&D. Holmes made it an area effect that prohibited speaking, in the 1st edition Player's Handbook this was codified to mean that spells couldn’t be cast and its offensive potential was realized with the inclusion of a saving throw.

Moldvay Basic (1981)

Silence 15’ Radius

Range: 180’ Duration: 12 turns

This spell will make an area with a 30’ diameter totally silent. Conversation and spells in this area will be prevented for the duration of the spell. This spell does not prevent a person within the area from hearing noises made outside the area. If cast at a person, the victim must save vs. Spells, or the spell effect will move with him! If the saving throw is successful, the spell will remain in the area in which it was cast, and the victim may move out of it.

Moldvay takes the nod from AD&D maintaining basically the same spell. The only noticeable difference is the duration which does not scale like it does in AD&D.

Rules Cyclopedia (1991)

Silence 15' Radius

Range: 180' Duration: 12 turns Effect: Sphere of silence 30' across

This spell makes the area of effect totally silent. Conversation and spellcasting in this area are impossible for the duration of the spell. This spell does not prevent a person within the area from hearing noises outside the area. If cast on a creature, the victim must make a saving throw vs. spells or the spell effects will move with the creature. If the saving throw is successful, the spell remains in the area in which it was cast, and the victim may move out of the area.

As expected, minor wordsmithing from the Moldvay version. Now - indulge me when I introduce one more spell that is NOT Silence.

Cook Expert (1981)

Invisibility 10’ Radius

Range: 120’ Duration: Special

This spell makes the creature it is cast on and all creatures within 10’ at the time of casting invisible. This area will move with the person it is cast upon. This spell otherwise acts as an invisibility spell, but the creatures in the area of effect who move more than 10’ away from the creature the spell is cast on will become visible.

My supposition is thus: Silence was initially intended to be the counterpoint to invisibility, “auditory invisibility” could have been another name for it. However, it required more rulings at the table. If I say something, can I be heard? Dungeonmasters might rule that you can’t because you can’t make any sounds. That makes conversation impossible. Then it's a small hop to making casting impossible. The biggest deviation in understanding of the spell was perhaps Holmes when the spell transitioned from a spell that targeted creatures or objects to an area of effect spell with a radiating effect instead of a personal effect on those effected.  Clever players figured out that based on ruling they could use the spell to shut down enemy casters, so Dungeonmasters added a saving throw - and the weaponization of the spell was complete. The next spell that specifically strips spellcasters of their spellcasting cannot be obtained until level 5 Feeble Mind, which is not AoE and does not have the same out of combat utility - objectively a weaker spell than Silence 15 ft Radius at level 2.


I have a version of Silence 15 ft Radius if it stayed closer to its OD&D roots with a nice clean Moldvay/Cook update.

The Gibbering Blog (2023)

Silence 15’ Radius

Range: 120’ Duration: 12 Turns

This spell makes the creature it is cast on and all creatures within 15’ at the time move silently. This area will move with the person it is cast upon, but the creatures in the area of effect who move more than 15’ away from the creature the spell is cast on will begin making sound. If any effected creature speaks, the spell immediately ends. This spell can also be cast on an object so that the object creates no sound, for example it could be cast on a door before it is bashed down.

Moving Down Under

No, I'm not moving to Australia. That would be dope, but that is not what this is about.

Arnold K over at Goblin Punch Blog wrote a phenomenal post what he coined "the Underclock." It it replaces Wandering Monsters, Event Dice, Overloaded Encounter Dice, Hazard System, and Tension Pools. Click on any of those links for great thoughts from more experienced creators than myself. There are a lot of great systems out there, but at my table they are hard for me to track. Now, I am not a very experienced Dungeon Master. I played in High School, did some play by post through college, then didn't pick up a book again until my middle son dug the 1st edition monster manual out of my closet and decided he wanted to play. My gaming group consists of a 7 year old, an 8 year old, and a 13 year old.

What really drew me in was Arnold's breaking down suspense vs. surprise. The red text is quoted directly from his blog post that I linked previously. I want that - I want suspense.

Suspense vs Surprise 

• Surprise is when the alien suddenly attacks.
• Suspense is when you know the aliens are getting closer.  You are running out of time, and you are running out of ammo.  I think that most DMs want their players to feel suspense, more than surprise.
• A truly random roll (a flat 1-in-6 chance) doesn't offer much suspense.  Surprise, but not suspense.
• To increase suspense, you want the players to feel like they're running out of time.

 

However, I think the actual problem with all of this time tracking is that it isn't intuitive. I am steeped in G+ (when it was around), blogs, podcasts, discords, reddits, etc that are focused on "old school play." Listening, reading, and writing about it is my hobby. I have heard all the arguments about why the 10 minute dungeon turn makes sense. The problem is, it still doesn't (to me). Forty feet, about ~13 yards in 10 minutes. That is 4 feet per minute. The average step length (start with both feet together, lift your left foot and step forward, now both feet are on the ground with your left foot in front of you right foot - that is your step length) is 2 to 2.5 feet. Now, if you lift your right foot and step forward so it is now on the ground in front of your left foot that is called a stride. The typical stride is approximately 5 feet. Your character walking down a 10 foot wide hall is literally taking less than 1 stride per minute. That is sickeningly slow.

To put it another way, a mile has 5,280 feet or 132 increments of 40 feet. It would take a character 1320 minutes (10 minute turns) or 22 hours to walk one mile in the dungeon. From the base camp on Mount Everest to the summit it is just shy of 13 miles and can be completed in 2 to 3 days (according to some quick google research). We will take 3 days, that is 4 miles per day!

For our typical adventurer that 13 miles is 68,640 feet which could be broken down into 1,716 segments of 40 feet each. Each segment would take 10 minutes to traverse so it would take 286 hours. Assuming a forced march of 10 hours per day, the adventurer would take nearly 29 days to make it from base camp to the summit.

"But that's outside! Adventurers go faster outside!" I hear you exclaiming. That adventurer in the wilderness is traveling at base 120 / 5 = 24 miles per day x mountain terrain (50%) = 12 miles per day. The adventurer is actually 3x too fast!

Yes, and no. I used this example because while most of probably do not a great grasp on what the trek up Mount Everest is from base camp to the summit, we can probably agree that it is an extremely challenging climb. It is done at night so that you have light on your way back down. It is HARD. But you know what is harder? That 40 feet of 10 foot wide hallway stretched out before our adventurers.

I'm extremely open to someone disagreeing with me and opening my eyes to something that I am missing, but right now in my opinion the simulation is wrong and that is what causes the dissonance time tracking rules that make them so hard to implement at the table. We cannot imagine moving THAT slow.

If we wanted a closer approximation, we'd be looking at 400 feet per turn for dungeon movement, or forty feet per minute of travel (that is still only walking .45 miles/hr). And perhaps there is the answer. Perhaps the movement speed isn't wrong, maybe its the length of a turn. What if turns were per minute? Take out your phone, set the timer for one minute, and do nothing but watch it. A minute is a substantial amount of time when you stop and really observe its passing.

So a 1 minute turn, reminds me of the 1 minute combat round. Maybe AD&D was onto something. If you were making checks every other turn (2 minutes) that means that the party would encounter something every 10ish minutes which feels a little too frequent.

I'm not a fan of usage dice (The Black Hack) for my consumables (except wands because I like not knowing when the last charge is spent) but I like it as a mechanism. Here is my thought -

Every other minute (now equal to one turn) the players spend in the dungeon they roll for Danger. Danger starts out as a D20. On a 1 or a 2 the Danger increases and the dice goes to the next size smaller (D20, D12, D10, D8, D6, D4). A 1 will actually result in another roll immediately on the next die size down. When a 1 or 2 appear on a D4, the jig is up and the adventurers are actively being hunted.

Certain actions will automatically reduce the die size without a roll:

• Loud noises (breaking down a door, cave in)
• Getting into protracted combat
• Leaving obvious clues behind (trashing a room, spiking doors, dead bodies)

Certain actions can increase the die size (once the die has been reduced below d20 it cannot get higher than d12 again unless the party leaves the dungeon for an extended period of time).

• Hiding in secret rooms
• Concealment/Illusion magic
• Silently taking out guards/sentries

This would result in an average of 30 checks (1 hour) before shit hit the fan. Every time the die decreases that is a chance for the DM to give a portent of the dangers lurking so there is plenty of opportunity to build tension.

Empty Rooms

 I did the math on Dungeon23 based on the dungeon stocking B/X rules.

 

1-2: Empty (Treasure 1-in-6)

3-4: Monster (Treasure 3-in-6)

5: Special (No Treasure)

6: Trap (Treasure 2-in-6)

 

Taking these probabilities across 365 rooms, your distribution would look like this:

I am about 41 days behind, but thankfully I think I can catch up because there are 101 Empty Rooms that I can work on! I am using the Dungeon23 challenge to convert some of my home campaign notes and practice the OSE house style as I (grudgingly) have found that it is intuitive to use at the table. Without further ado, let's knock out a few empty rooms!

TOWER ENTRANCE

Cut stone (moss covered, crumbling). Rusted portcullis (black iron, bars shaped like snakes). Brass bell (hung to the left, missing clapper). Gargoyle face (top center, long nose, buck teeth, horn nubs).

 

=>Look inside: Dark 30' square chamber. Winch (lifting mechanism) to the inside right of the door. A wooden door is directly across from the portcullis (west).

=>Strike bell: The gargoyle's mouth moves and speaks: "Ding dong. Oops, only death resides here." It then descends into cackling laughter. If struck again, the message repeats.

 

PANTRY

Stone blocks (dry, walls, ceiling 8' high). Shelves (wooden, built in, lined with cheese wheels). Straw (covers floor).

 

=>Investigate cheese: It has aged far too long and is hard as rock. The wax flakes away.

=>Search in straw: A trapdoor to X is hidden under the straw.

 

CHAPEL

Carved stone (dripping, 30' vaulted ceiling). Stone pews (crumbling, flecks of red paint remain). Crystal alter (deep purple, natural but shaped). Tapestries (cover walls, tattered except for one).

 

=>Investigate pews: It appears that many have been intentionally smashed

=>Investigate alter: The crystal appears to grow naturally from the floor. Unbreakable.

=>Investigate tapestry: The one tapestry which has not resigned itself to time depicts a deranged goat eating the moon. It is an illusion concealing a passage to X.

 

PIT

Excavated stone (20' deep, 10' across, sheer sides). Filled with bones (humanoid and animal).

 

=>Search pit: Among the bones there is a key ring with an iron key, a brass key, and bone key.

 

And that's it for today.  Now I'm only 37 days behind...